I talked to a friend online a couple of weeks ago and she told me that she wasn’t a good submissive due to the fact that she did things on her own in play and didn’t always listen to the person dominating her. This made me think for a while about what is a good submissive.
I will approach this from a different angle; I will try my best to write about this from a non-dominant perspective. What I write is not always something that should be generalised and applied to every submissive in the world.
So here we go…
So what is a good submissive? This seems to be a holy graal to a lot of people, even on the dominant side and it is almost like people are looking for a benchmark to judge themselves against. Before we go further into the discussion I want to kill a big myth: BDSM is not a competition – There is no way to be “the best submissive”, it all depends on who you are playing with. Someone that is a good submissive to me could just be obnoxious to another dominant.
It is also easy, from an outside perspective, to only see external expressions of submission as things that makes a good submissive. Seeing things like kneeling, obedience etc. is very easy, seeing what is going on inside the submissive is somewhat harder.
But let’s get back to my friend’s opinion that she wasn’t a good submissve due to the above stated reasons, and now comes the funny part; Her own statement actually makes her a good submissive and she has the potential to become a really good one too. Her comments about her own submissive skills shows that she is doing something that is really important – Processing.
Processing is a really important skill within BDSM, it shows that you are able to take in all the experiences you made during a scene and deal with them and this is utterly important in order to develop your BDSM skills, no matter if you are a dominant or a submissive. How the processing is done and how long it takes is very individual, some submissives want to talk when the processing starts, while others don’t want to talk until they have externalised their thoughts and made them into something that is understandable. A good submissive skill is also to be able to involve the dominant in the processing or at least to be able to inform of what is going on. To me processing is done in tandem, some parts of the processing is driven by the dominant, other parts are driven by the submissive – But it is always done together.
It isn’t possible to express every experience or thought in words, but make no mistake about it – They will come out one way or the other and that is something that both the submissive and the dominant have to be prepared for. The solution that is the king in every BDSM related situation; Communication.
So my friend that inspired me to do this post is a good submissive in the making; She is communicating and she is processing.
It seems to me the very best submissives and dominants have this in common, despite all the variety they display: they all at times question themselves on how good are they, how they can be better. A sub or dom with no doubts and no desire to improve their BDSM is… boring. Possibly dangerous. One can only observe such metaphoric masturbation for so long. IMHO.
Good post! I agree on several points, but the two that stick out: the one about BDSM not being a competition, and the need for thinking about what you’re doing/feeling both in a scene and in “real life”.
In fact, that processing is important in every aspect of life. Was it Socrates that said, “An unexamined life isn’t worth living?” But when those of us who enjoy BDSM get involved in a scene, we tend to through examination of our actions/thought processes/emotions out the window. We want to live for the now, experience a total release from all thought and revel without analysis. Great for the moment, but if reflection doesn’t occur afterward, you’re right…where’s the growth?
Good post (and a wave to Cloud!)
Diana
I just wanted to add a quick “Me Too!” to the list.
I often doubt how I’m doing, whether I am doing well. What I could do better. I really appreciate the reminder that I need to involve my Domme in this introspection. Mostly it’s been self-introspection on my blog…
I’d like to add another to the list of quotes, though in my case I need to paraphrase because I can’t remember who said it or precisely how, but it’s one of the tenets by which I try to live my life (RL and SL): When we stop learning we start dying.
Keep learning everyone, especially about yourselves. I’ve learned some amazing things about myself in the last few months, I can’t wait to see what I learn about myself next…
I am sitting here half applauding and half seething at the above article. I love the parts about “processing” and the need for “communicating” between a Dominant and their submissive…and then I find myself livid with both the original author and the commenters for perpetuating what I see to be a real myth. It actually is equally as much the inaccuracy of the perpetuation and my feeling that yet again I need to play the Devil’s Advocate (DA for short,snort, snort)in order to set things back to a more balanced outlook. I understand the need to be touchy-feely and ever so SSC/RACK politically-correct when dealing with mostly novice players in the BDSM scene. However, it is an injustice to these same players IMHO to let them go on believing that things are all so gentle in the BDSM world: Point number 1: BDSM can be, actually, very competitive. We have numerous contests where the contestants compete for various awards and recognition for their skills and ability to convey an image which approximates what we believe to be the model or ideal BDSM person, couple, or group. When we evaluate a submissive it is with a set of ideals and the image of the model submissive for our needs and then analyzing how close they come to that ideal. We then adjust our training of them to try to “train-up” the deficiencies they exhibit and “expand” their horizons. Also, when a Dom or a sub go to a playspace(public or private group dungeon) they either consciously or sub-consciously compare the other Doms and subs to themselves. Sometimes by doing so they find ways to improve themselves, as well as see where they are doing something better than someone else, in their eyes. I would even go so far as to say that many take Pride in their competencey and enjoy flaunting it. Just as though they were competing. After all, if you were a sub and you were able to make your Dom look good wouldn’t you want to?Be honest with yourself. Doms, do you not take an extra satisfaction, even some Pride, when your sub performs or measures up to the others around you? Now be honest with your self. So, everyone is looking, everyone comparing, and everyone is competing in some way, even if its for a little recognition of your hard work and dedication. Yes, yes, we don’t mind sharing our experience and expertise with others, and we will welcome you into our leather lifestyle, but we will always be there, taking our mental notes, comparing yours to ours. It is part of the nature of the D/s beast.
Point 2: Your “friend” will only make a good submissive if she chooses to change due to the “processing” she is doing. I have had submissives fully capable of “processing” and communicating this processing but who do little to try to act on it and actually change themselves enough to become a “good submissive” for my needs, wants, or tastes.
Point 3: I know I just sounded a bit harsh and judgemental up above but as you have pointed out in other articles there are many varied and diverse points of viewin the BDSM world. And, I seem to be the defacto DA (I heard that all the way from here!) around here. ( 🙂 )
With Love in BDSM, -LordSir Ninetails
Contests in BDSM related skills like boot polishing and flogging are not BDSM. I think you can demo excellent ACTIVITY like flogging skills but not the ideal of “BDSM person, couple or group” and if Mr Leather 2009 actually thinks he is The Ideal BDSM person I would be surprised, amused, and saddened; he may or may not be an excellent BDSMer, and/ or an marvelous role model, or just very god damned yummy in leather.
I evaluate my submissived based on who they are and what they and I hope they can be; comparisons to other submissives is harmful IMHO. I am not going to think badly of a sub who cannot kneel correctly, if posture training is not a consensual goal. Some people have bad knees or backs; that doesn’t make them a bad sub. Some people have inate grace, and can kneel gracefully and maintain it for a long time; that doesn’t make them a good sub either.
Any sub of mine that flaunts their talents in front of another sub or a Dominant to make them feel lesser will get a REAL punishment, a serious talking to, and perhaps release from my service. Such arrogance and discourtesy is NOT acceptable. I would probably enjoy the displays of competancy of another Dom or sub, but not if ill mannered and inspired by mean spiritedness. I certainly would enjoy my subs efforts to please me in public, and be happy also if they performed well so that I have the pleasurable opportunity to note it and reward them.
As for Stoltz’s friend the submissive; good submissision IMHO is not about giving UP oneself, but giving oneself. The difference is whether the inner essence and potential of the sub is appreciated and cherished; that is something I teach my subs. Not all processing is about change. Growth in self awareness is a precious thing, and a prerequisite to self initiated change. She explores submission with a growing self awareness, weighing what is and is not the essence, asking herself and a dominant she trusts good questions. 🙂 Good girl.
Okay, let me restate what I said( with a few additions to help make things more “transparent”lol): I said… “We have numerous contests where the contestants compete (there is a winner after all) for various awards and recognition for their skills AND ability to convey an IMAGE which APPROXIMATES what we believe to be the MODEL (Model=a standard or example for imitation or comparison.-from Dictionary.com) or ideal BDSM person, couple, or group.” These competitions are interwoven into the fabric of BDSM culture. Just because they are ALSO entertainment does not mean they are not part of BDSM. You can look up these websites for a glimpse of just how large a part of BDSM is, in fact, competition : http://www.internationalmasterandslave2008.com (for Cloud, 🙂 )
http://www.imsl.org
http://www.imrl.com
http://www.olympusleather.com
Also, I would agree with you that none of these contestants believe they are the Be All, End All of BDSM and would tell you that they are always learning, processing, and attempting to make the necessary changes in their behaviour to become closer to their own image of what the ideal or model BDSM person would be.
Further, I would agree that someone who flaunts themselves to purposely make someone else feel Lesser is in fact an inferior product themselves. However, I will admit a bit of amusement and Pride comes over me when one of my products flaunts the assets they have acquired in order to show off how well they have “processed” and incorporated their learning into their Being.
Always,With Love in BDSM, -LordSir Ninetails
[…] Ninetails inspired me to write this post as he became the devil’s advocate in the replies under this post, which has been highly appreciated. and being the Devils advocate is always important and […]
Perhaps we could start by drawing distinction between “competitive,” in the sense of striving to optimize one’s skill in any endeavor and “competition,” as in striving to triumph over one or more others in that chosen field? I daresay that either sub or Dom/me who fails to satisfy the other, regardless of how many medals or certificates of proficiency they possess, is, effectively, the loser. Even though no competition took place.
I think it is not BDSM that is inherently competitive, but life itself. It is in each of our best interests to improve, to build upon what we have learned in the past, to become – and to see ourselves become – better at whatever. Therein lies the potential for “processing.” Whether we utilize that potential is another matter, of course.
And the processing may be either internal, as a result of observation and striving to understand some situation, or the result of an external dialogue with one or more others, although the processing is still carried out internally, either during or following the discussion, possibly both.
Which is where communication enters the picture. It could be argued that I found SL because of the demise of a RL relationship. Now this woman and I were entirely frank and forthcoming with each other. We believed we were communicating. We even patted ourselves on the back, so to speak, about how well we communicated. Except.
It was not until the relationship had ended and I had moved out of her house that we discovered the root of the problem: she had thought that if I moved in, ran her ranch, then spent the rest of each day writing, I would somehow magically produce a Best-Seller. Her faith in my ability was not rooted in reality. Bottom line is, because I did not produce the book she had imagined, in her mind I was not “writing.” Silly me, I thought the process of brining words from my brain onto the word processor was “writing.” We fought, never understanding that the whole issue hinged on two differing definitions of the same term.
And as a result of processing that, and processing the seeming inconsistency of almost every woman I met after coming to SL wanting to be my slave, I finally understood that communication is not guaranteed even though two people make no effort at concealment and there is nothing inherently wrong with either wanting to be a slave or taking enjoyment from that desire in one who wishes to serve you.
I could not have learned these things had our genuine efforts to communicate not gone awry, could not have found SL or the women whose persistence allowed me to see I should not judge others by my own standards, but by theirs. And I have gone on at much greater length than I had anticipated, so by way of compensation I will not plague you again for a week or so…
Oh… and what makes a good sub? Why not ask what makes a good Master or Mistress? Even better, why not ask, “how long is a piece of string?” Be well.
Zeb
Points well taken, Zeb, and I would agree that there may be a need for clearer definitions when something is stated as though it were fact, as generalizations or blanket statements about the BDSM lifestyle are rarely interpreted the same way by everyone in the lifestyle. Nevertheless, it does make an opening for vigorous discussion or debate on the chosen topic and in the aftermath provides a somewhat broader answer or view. 🙂 With Love in BDSM, -LordSir Ninetails
After reading the article and as much as the comments as I can (I’m running on low energy and attention), I believe that reflection (called processing here) and communication are important skills in all interactions. I believe someone mentioned that before, but even in vanilla, if there’s no talking between partners or keeping it out of site and out of mind, problems are bound to occur. Granted, I also see the point that just thinking and talking won’t go far if it is not acted upon.
I believe the point about BDSM not being a competition falls in the line of there not being a “best person”. Sure, we have Gandhi, Martin Luther King Jr. and a slew of other notable individuals who are excellent representatives of what it means to be a good human being. But that doesn’t mean they inspire everyone the same way, or at all. Same thing with music- people have their favorite genres and bands, and there are even competitions where conflicting styles are compared. But ultimately, which is exactly “best” depends on the audience. My parents thought I was an amazing performer in elementary school, but I sure as hell am not getting a record deal. 😛
Finally, as an outsider, the only thing I can add that would make a good sub is one not only aware of their needs and their dominant’s needs, but being aware of surroundings and who is in that surrounding. From what I know (which is subject to inaccuracies), the sub can dictate a good deal what goes on. One thing that bugs me is when subs and doms or slaves/masters are out in a non-BDSM/Gor/related area and heavily displaying some of the activities that go on. I know in real life it would not be accpetable if a dom was dragging their sub around on their hands and knees through J.C. Penny’s, so I’m confused as to why it’s more acceptable in the virtual casual stores. I have heard that some subs/slaves feel ‘unloved’ if they are not treated this way, and I guess that just seems very selfish and disrespectful. I don’t tromp around in full fantasy RP gear and shot people while I’m at PixelDolls, and it’s not appreciated when I do see other roleplayers doing this. I have nothing wrong with people wearing collars and using certain forms of language (the third person can be irritating, but I can deal with it), but some awareness of others would – to me, anyways – show a greater understanding and control of the role.
Maybe I’m nuts, but I could see how some doms might also just want their sub to be a regular shopping partner part of the time and an intimate playmate at others, rather than all the time. I know showering lovey-dovey talk on my significant other would drive me crazy and drain my energy.
Terry, thank you for your excellent thought provoking post. I agree: communication is the foundation of any successful intimate relationship. Acting on words, and changing as awareness grows and is shared, seems to me to be basic honesty, and also basic to how we grow.
Taste, and subjectivity, are not bad things, they are just realistic. Of course, our mentors or parents were right when they saw and noted something extraordinary in each of us. And of course, everyone’s Dominant can maybe be The Best EVER. 🙂 (But mine really is. ::grins::)
Non robotic minions and subs are more tasty IMHO; courteous subs and Doms are often the most mature, authentic, and true to the essence of BDSMERs I know. BDSM in PG areas in SL strikes me as forcing possibly non-consenting people into being voyeurs; a bit tacky, at least, and I say that as a person with an enthusiastic exhibitionistic streak… However – flying is also not something people do in RL; the culture in SL is more tolerant than much of RL, and if that means enduring faux pases (and a diverse and sometimes jarring mainland) I can stand it.
However I agree absolutely that most of the RL BDSMers I know appreciate Out Of Role time with lovers who are more than BDSM playmates. People are more than personas, and more than roles, and consent is a vibrant living thing made most interesting by the depth and reality of the individuals giving and accepting it. 24/7 BDSM is NOT Perfection, for many RL BDSMers who enjoy 24/7 relationships. In my experience, and opinion. 🙂
Communication. Self-awareness. What you like, will stand, want more or less of, what you tolerate. The path to understanding Self. And this process can be short or long. It can be filled with wonder and pitfalls.
Whatever the type of relationship a couple is in, honest communication with self and the partner is necessary, as the above stories have made abundantly clear.
I thank you all for your comments and Sir Stoltz for this article.